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Post by Grnkjr0 on Mar 23, 2010 4:10:55 GMT
Rxtus uses pad and paragleiber uses wheel - maybe pad favors bonus cars? It is also clear to me that rxtus´s car was much faster than paragleibers in those videos. On Spa he keeps pulling away once he overtook.
Poul
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Post by SPEEDFr3ak on Mar 23, 2010 19:03:23 GMT
A pad surely not favors a bonus car, I think. What I experienced ,the MC12 was much more stable and exactly with a wheel. But a pad is faster on some short tracks with tight corners.I'd count Ambush to these tracks ,because its easy to loose seconds in the last part with the sharp corners at the end.
Philipp
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Post by TomasT (PC) on Mar 23, 2010 22:38:46 GMT
Thats funny. I thought those last tricky corners on the hill in ambush canyon was one of very few places where I noticed an advantage when I bought the wheel.
I guess controller settings have more to do with that than actual controller.
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Post by SPEEDFr3ak on Mar 23, 2010 23:53:47 GMT
Could be. But at least in this last corners ,a fast steerig reaction is needed.I think a Pad can do this better and has a small benefit on those tracks.A good example is Ebisu e.g. With a small steering radius on the wheel (<90° , I think) the controllers a nearly equal.That was my experience so far;) So in conclusion I'd say the radius is important.
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Post by rcgldr on Mar 25, 2010 5:45:48 GMT
The more videos I see like these, the more convinced I am that NFS Shift's gameplay, specifically bouncing and grip level, and the corresponding lap times, are affected by a players system, but I don't know what specifically is causing this.
Other racing games don't have this problem. Even if the graphics are affected by a slower system, the control inputs, gameplay, and lap times are not affected. The main exception was NFS Undercover which would pause the entire game if it got behind.
The classic NFS games, like High Stakes and Porsche Unleashed never had this problem.
I like NFS Shift, but it's not a good platform for competitive play because of the system sensitivity. You'd need a LAN party where all PC's are identical to make the game fair.
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Post by SPEEDFr3ak on Mar 25, 2010 10:22:40 GMT
I dont think it's especially affected by the system ,this game has a big luckfactor, easy visitable at Spa , Ambush and Nordschleife.Sometimes I run the Nordschleife below 6 and as smooth as ProxKruiz and sometimes my Zonda is unstable and bounces a lot.On Ambush the same.In Spa is Eau Rouge pure luck.Sometimes 205, then 235 kmh in this corner
Philipp
EDIT: And this also happens in quickrace.
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Post by Grnkjr0 on Mar 25, 2010 16:24:59 GMT
Did anyone tell Jeff how to change defaultfiles within wrecord ?
Poul
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Post by rcgldr on Mar 25, 2010 23:38:40 GMT
I dont think it's especially affected by the system ,this game has a big luckfactor, easy visitable at Spa , Ambush and Nordschleife. Sometimes I run the Nordschleife below 6 and as smooth as ProxKruiz and sometimes my Zonda is unstable and bounces a lot.On Ambush the same.In Spa is Eau Rouge pure luck. Sometimes 205, then 235 kmh in this corner Some of the tracks do involve luck in some key turns, such as Eau Rouge at Spa because of the bouncing issue. Nordschliefe is long enough that one corner isn't going to result in a 5 second difference in lap times. It is possible that there's some quirk in the game related to tire temperatures and the corresponding grip that's affected by a players system, but I think that the same issue that causes the bouncing is having an indirect effect on grip. If you've raced other players online, there are a lot of players that seem slower, using the same assists as you, yet they have to brake sooner and take turns slower because they are getting less grip (and/or power?). Similar to the video with rtxus, I can easily follow these slower players, having to ease off the throttle and brake sooner than normal, because I'm getting more grip and/or power than those other slower players. If I tap them from behind on a straight, even though it speeds them up and slows me down, I quickly close the gap after just 1 or 2 turns. At the same time I recall a short online session with Cipriani, and at every track, in 14.0 and lower rated cars, where the grip variation seems to have even more effect, he was gaining on me about 1/2 second in every turn, despite sometimes starting at the back of the pack when I started at the front, where he had to drive through the field which meant he couldn't use some ideal racing line, yet still managed about the same rate of closure. I doubt it's setup, because Anak did this standing start 5:54.120 lap at Nordshliefe in default tuned Zonda R. This is a video made from a replay which reduces the visual bouncing a little, but the bouncing is noticably less than videos made from replays made by most other players: www.youtube.com/watch?v=52CD3AxctyE&fmt=22
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Post by SPEEDFr3ak on Mar 25, 2010 23:57:46 GMT
To the vid.I defintily doubt ,that this was a default Zonda.In Schwedenkreuz with more than 330, that cant be a stock setup without changes.I've taken a look at it many times and some places seem really unreal for me , he can drive some corners a lot faster than r4veNNN who was able to do a 5:48.So Anak has a bit too much grip in my view.Well I tried it too and concentrated on a few corners , they arent masterable this way. The speed in the corners is sometimes unsual fast, but the speed in acclerating is normal.Also the line isnt perfect.I've never seen such a phenomenon except for me increasing grip!
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Post by rcgldr on Mar 26, 2010 3:32:51 GMT
So Anak has a bit too much grip in my view. Note that most of Anak's videos were made before any grip hacks were available. The modding tools used to increase grip didn't exist (or were little known) at that time, so it's very unlikely that his game was modified (assuming he wasn't capable of reverse engineering the .bff files on his own). Also based on his thread at NFS Unlimited, there was no claim of those laps being fast, it was just meant to be a comparason of various cars at Nordschleife without tuning. Link to that thread: forum.nfsunlimited.net/viewtopic.php?f=140&t=17940With the current state of the modding tools, grip can be modified, but I'm not aware of any mod to reduce the bouncing, yet I see youtube videos where the bouncing is much less than normal. It turns out that videos made from replays from hood cam reduces the bouncing, so those videos will look unusually smooth. The videos made from replays from in car view only reduce the bouncing slightly and these can be compared to see differences.
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Post by SPEEDFr3ak on Mar 26, 2010 8:20:53 GMT
Anaks times are really fast esp the CCX, Veyron, Zonda F, which aint really controlable on the track with the stock setup.But some are slow like the Elise with 6:35, where a 6:26 is possible
But why has anak two youtube accounts then?arathrok and Rawana?I didnt acuse anak to cheat , but Rawanas video on youtube you linked seems unreal. I didnt say his videos look too smooth.The Speeds are sometimes too high and seemed to be slightly cheated
btw.Converting bff files and mod them was discovered in Sept.25th 09 Unpacking the game was discovered in Sept.28th 09
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Post by rcgldr on Mar 26, 2010 16:31:49 GMT
Anaks times are really fast esp the CCX, Veyron, Zonda F, Well you can look at Cipriani's videos, except he hasn't posted one for Nordschleife, that I'm aware of. His Willow Springs video speeds were close to zx12rcr's willow springs, although zx12rcr stated that his 1:05.xxx times are some type of fluke lap times that happen once every 30 or 40 laps, plus zx12rcr ran in time attack mode which may be faster, possibley due to tire temperatures in time attack mode. Similar to Anak, zx12rcr doesn't appear to have made any more videos or played online in quite a while. In zx12rcr's case he stated he was going back to rFactor.
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Post by VGSpeedPro on Mar 26, 2010 17:17:16 GMT
Anak cheated, and Online the slower players use many assists which cause them to brake earlier! Mystery solved! Rogério
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Post by SPEEDFr3ak on Mar 26, 2010 17:20:30 GMT
Indeed:D
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Post by rcgldr on Mar 27, 2010 4:11:05 GMT
Possible, but it seems unlikely, since some of his runs were made before he made the videos, and before the stated Sept 28 date when the mods first started to appear and were only known to a very few number of players. I'm sure Cipriani isn't cheating and he also runs unusually fast lap times, especially in 14.0 events where what I think is a grip sensitivity to a players system is having more effect. However, what triggered this again for me was looking at Paragleiber's video and how quickly rtxus was able to close in on Paragleiber, closely follow, then easily pass. At Ambush Canyon, it seemed that rtxus was hanging back on the first 2 laps, then quickly closed and passed on the last lap, only to spin out on the last turn, perhaps due to a lag related collision. In the final race at Nordschliefe, he gets by and pulls away quite quickly. He can probably run sub 6:10's with the Aston Martin at Nordschliefe (that race was a 6:11). I've asked many of them and most are using no assists. Also it's not just the braking, I can out corner them and I'm seeing sufficient smoke from their tires to assume they are at the limits.
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