ar47
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Post by ar47 on Feb 5, 2010 6:24:12 GMT
I started training SHIFT a few days ago (i have Shift earlier but just don't have time for it), and it seems that i'm stuck with a big question: Steering Assist: off and low, which is better?
I watched some of Rogério's videos and I noticed that his ingame steering-wheel shakes a lot while going on straight lines. This leads to the thought that Rogério might use Steering Assist.
Before that, I absolutely believe that it's faster when u turn off all the assists. But now, I'm a bit unsure about it so that I made this thread hoping that good racers here like Rogerio, Norman, Poul... would help me clear the problem.
Best regards
P.s: I'm "AR47vn" when racing online, may i join you guys when playing?
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Post by TheGreenMonster (PC) on Feb 5, 2010 6:59:13 GMT
Hello Ar47
I can only speak for myself but I don't use any assist, No TC, ABS or Stabilty.... Everything is off
Monster
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ar47
ISRC Recruit
910521
Posts: 10
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Post by ar47 on Feb 5, 2010 7:49:42 GMT
Hello Ar47 I can only speak for myself but I don't use any assist, No TC, ABS or Stabilty.... Everything is off Monster Thanks, I don't use any assist too. =D But as i said, I'm now unsure about whether i should use steering assist at low level or not. =(
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Post by rcgldr on Feb 5, 2010 10:55:17 GMT
The in game steering wheel movements seem to be out sync with my actual control inputs. I use a joystick to steer, so I'm not sure what in car steering wheel movment is trying to convey in terms of feedback. The car seems to be responding to my actual inputs as opposed to what I see with the in car view of the steering wheel.
As far as the steering assist setting goes, some of the fastest player set steering assist low, traction control high. Most of the other players are running with all assists off. I tried it and although it didn't help with lap times a Nordshchliefe, it didn't hurt them either, at least not noticably. Steering assist low won't work at Willow Springs though, because the game's racing line is wrong at the high point of the track, and the steering assist will attempt to follow that line.
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Post by VGSpeedPro on Feb 5, 2010 11:22:24 GMT
Hi!
I Race using Hood and record not the actual Gameplay but the Replay using In-Car video... This to say that details like the one you are refering are not accurate.
I dont use any assists except ABS, which I use on some tracks... Curious enough, after almost 2 months of no WR, the couple of WR I still have were done without any Assists... Dont know if that means anything! ;P
Rogério
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Post by aarog5606 on Feb 5, 2010 12:32:50 GMT
I have not tried using any assists since the game first came out. I really dont know, but i do not see how using assists would be faster for an experienced, fast driver.
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Post by rcgldr on Feb 5, 2010 12:50:55 GMT
I have not tried using any assists since the game first came out. I really dont know, but i do not see how using assists would be faster for an experienced, fast driver. Well in real life, lap times are a bit slower in Formula 1 with traction control now banned. In some hard core sim-oriented games, the assists have to be deliberately handicapped slightly to prevent them from offering an advantage. In the case of NFS Shift, traction control off or high doesn't seem to make a significant difference in my lap times, but tractcion control off and autoclutch off results in much faster launches. ABS off is faster, if you use manual shift and downshift while braking. Anak (ardathrokok at youtube) uses traction contro high, steering assist low, and ran some of the fastest time during the youtube challenges, and he uses a G25 wheel. I've read that Wolfking uses the same settings, but he's using a gamepad, where the steering assist makes more sense.
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Post by TomasT (PC) on Feb 5, 2010 13:27:52 GMT
Well I would like to ask Rogerio who obviously know how to control the braking with both ABS on and off.
Could you explain the technique, how it differs, any tip on how to get better at having it off. It is shorter breaking distances, but still my times are slower when I try it. I get that I need practice but all my training with this game has been with ABS on unfortunately.
Take Road America for example, I have alot of training there and think I have perfected my line and cornering to what should be enough, but I cant get under 1,50,5. Could this be due to ABS on or should I stop complaining and get back to practice? =)
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Post by TheGreenMonster (PC) on Feb 5, 2010 17:02:00 GMT
O'yea I forgot to mention that I am using a G25 wheel and after having all assist off for a long time, I can't drive with any assist on
I am fighting with the wheel, If your on the wrong side of the track because there someone else where you should be the assist will keep trying to get back to the race line, thus running racers off the road or worse yet crashing into them.
Sometime when racing with a lot of people its hard to stay on the race line. The assist is not friendly about letting you pass clean.
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Post by rcgldr on Feb 5, 2010 23:34:04 GMT
I am fighting with the wheel, If your on the wrong side of the track because there someone else where you should be the assist will keep trying to get back to the race line, thus running racers off the road or worse yet crashing into them. I don't think anyone is suggesting using steering assist low for online play. As mentioned you have to fight it too much to avoid other players. I would assume steering assist low is just for hot lapping. In other games, like Nascar Racing Season 2003, steering assist could be set to 80% to 90% and it generally ended up helping with the online play on the high speed ovals, since it didn't fight you when you wanted to change your line to avoid or pass other players, yet at the same time it kept your car from spinning out and causing a pile up (up to 40 players drafting in a tight pack on those oval races). This was a case where I wanted the other players to be using steering assists online. Getting back to NFS Shift assists, setting traction control to high prevents the fast launches, but it doesn't seem to have much effect on my lap times. I haven't messed much with stability control. I already have the opinion that there are hidden traction control and stability control assists that you can't turn off, although it somewhat dependent on the car, as the ZondaR is much more forgiving than the works Z06 with all assists off. As mentioned before Anak used steering assist low, traction control high to make a series of runs and some videos with upgraded but untuned cars at Nordschliefe, which I don't think anyone has been able to equal or beat. Link to his thread at NFS Unlimited: forum.nfsunlimited.net/viewtopic.php?f=140&t=17940ABS on is slower for me, but that could be because I only use a limited number of cars for online play. I find that braking is fastest if you downshift early while braking (or in some cars that downshfit slowly, downshifting while still at full throttle before braking). Maybe it would help with the 67 Stingray that I setup for 10.0 with no brake upgrades, but I've since found that tapping the handbrake and skidding a bit sideways into turns gets it to brake a bit faster, although there are only a few hairpin like turns you can slide into that way.
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Post by VGSpeedPro on Feb 6, 2010 14:39:43 GMT
Well I would like to ask Rogerio who obviously know how to control the braking with both ABS on and off. Could you explain the technique, how it differs, any tip on how to get better at having it off. It is shorter breaking distances, but still my times are slower when I try it. I get that I need practice but all my training with this game has been with ABS on unfortunately. Take Road America for example, I have alot of training there and think I have perfected my line and cornering to what should be enough, but I cant get under 1,50,5. Could this be due to ABS on or should I stop complaining and get back to practice? =) Hi mate! The tracks for ABS On or Off can be easaly spoted: if you have a track like Road America with several very long straights followed by slow corners where braking is very hard, ABS Off is the way to go because it will make the braking distance shorter. If you have a track like Nord where almost all corners are medium speed and only a small percentage force you to really brake, you should have ABS On because this way the wheels dont block and you can turn-in with more speed and keeping more speed in the middle of the corner. As you might have already understood, in Road America I dont use ABS or anything else for that matter. I never tested it for real, but I am guessing that with ABS On I would be up to 1s slower in this particular track, using the Zonda R. Cya! Hope it helps! Rogério
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Post by TheGreenMonster (PC) on Feb 6, 2010 22:12:51 GMT
I've done my own testing on ABS,, I found that with ABS on the car is slower on almost all tracks. It's slower by .01 sec but that could be the difference between winning and losing a race.
So for me ABS is "off"
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Post by TomasT (PC) on Feb 6, 2010 22:54:09 GMT
My own analyzing went similar as Rogerios. Thanks for your input, appreciate it.
Talking about Road America. The thing is, I think when youre under ... lets say 1,52, on a constant basis, whether you use ABS or not, your close to perfecting the braking points and turning points and the other techniques for the track.
That awareness of one single track, takes quite alot of practice, at least for me. (I use spots and marks on the road for breaking points, I guess everyone has their own little system to remember)
But I'm actually slower with abs off even on road america. My guess is that I would need to reevaluate the breaking points to perfection, and it's something that I cant do in under 15 laps at least.
The technique thing is what I would like to get explained by someone like Rogerio that are used to using both ABS on and off, cause the assumption that youre faster with what youre used to proves anything you like, like the difference in Sunny and me for example. Different breaking points. I guess, it would probably be faster, since it's a guessing game for me when to brake without ABS, to brake a little to soon than have to take a corner too wide.
The technique that you use without ABS and how it differs. When I turn off ABS, I notice that when I'm breaking, the car goes straight even if I turn, which is logical, but with ABS, I can almost brake and turn since the wheels doesnt lock up (using the turning as braking the car too) with the right angle into the corner. Where as without it, I need to get down to the right speed, before turning into the corner in the right place. Is this right and are there any tips for me? Could it be that you need some difference in tuning, break balance for example?
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Post by VGSpeedPro on Feb 7, 2010 0:17:46 GMT
Hi mate!
Well, I went to WR Site and saw you there and I remembered you are using Gamepad...
Braking will always be different for us because I have something you dont have: I have an axis for braking and another for accelerating, while you use the same. Why is this relevant? Because I can brake and accelerate at the same time, while you can only do one thing or the other. Being able to do what I do allows me to turn-in the car even if I block the wheels a bit... Besides that, Wheel Pedals allow much more control over braking, because the axis is quite bigger then what a Gamepad allows, which is important in Shift.
I think the fastest Gamepad Drivers use Steering Assist Low, which explains why they can fight Wheel Drivers in Tracks with lots of bouncing.
Anyway, in the end is probably just a matter of preference... As far as I know, Cipriani always uses ABS and he always is competitive.
Why dont you start using a Wheel? I am pretty sure that after you adapt the only question you will have is why it took you so long! ;P
Rogério
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Post by rcgldr on Feb 7, 2010 0:21:20 GMT
With ABS off downshift early so the engine goes way past redline, and cars like the Zonda R will end up stopping much faster. I can wait until almost 1/3rd down the hill at the end of the back straight at Road America, then downshift into 5th and brake at the same, using the downshifting to somewhat control the rate of braking.
I don't try to brake much while turning unless it's a hairpin like Spa GP. For that hairpin at the end of the back straight at Road America, I like to get the braking done first, then be back on the throttle. The next section is a short straight, so it would seem that late braking while at high speed before would help lap times more than going for a good corner exit speed on such a short straight that follows that hair pin. The situation at Spa is different because you have a longer straight after the hairpin.
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